He is one of the best, most honest, genuine people you would ever meet and the way this was spun (like Aaron is after slave labor) I have to completely disagree with.

If you want a corporation to rip apart stick with Walmart. They are the devil’s own…

There ended my spec work days.

Next, Threadless. No spec work. They don’t ask for specifics or a brief as such and ALL the work you do for it is sellable. In fact I have resold around 60% of all the designs I have subbed to threadless. Also it is a great way to get fast feedback from an impressive amount of artists and designers.

Threadless does not require specific designs skewed toward any particular brand or theme for competition. Work submitted remains the rights of the individual unless selected.

If one were to, say, enter a personal work at Threadless’ regular competition, no time or effort is lost.

Creating a specific piece of art for a specific client with no guarantee of payment and an unlikely ability to reappropriate it later (a design created for and featuring billabong text, for example), is a totally different animal. I’ve spoken at length on this in the past, but I’m betting no amount of reasoning with you would bear fruit. I’d like to kindly ask that you adopt a more civil tone should you choose to communicate further.

Get a life !!

Sounds like the “You hire based upon that skillset/portfolio/reputation/etc.” is the way to go…

I came to this looking to show my son some of Aaron’s work (Aaron being a friend), because my son is 7 and shows an interest in illustration. I’m trying to open his mind to lots of opportunity including illustration for film production/special effects/matte painting as well as traditional print & online design. Thanks for the insight on the whole “spec” thing.

I’d say that Billabong is the one not following fairly simple industry protocol. Chances are, they’ll end up making more (both monetarily and recognition-wise) off of the illustration than the artist does, so they are the ones that need to step back and look at the bigger picture.

Collaborate with an artist you feel has the technical merit and the ability to compromise their style (should that be an issue) instead of BCCing a bunch and hoping to win the lottery with one.

B. Your statement is ridiculous. Snapping a hundred ‘surf shots’ in a day, is not the same as laboring over an illustration for a week. And when they solicit FREE work to see if it’ll work for them, they don’t just want some sample sketches, which would be the norm for the start of an actual paid gig.

Your photography example also contradicts itself. Do you think any well respected photographer would go out and shoot for free and then solicit their photos to mags in hopes of people buying one? They get paid to go on location, their expenses are reimbursed, and they are paid for completion of the project.

If you’re in high school / college and taking pics of your friends and potentially getting into a Billabong ad is your goal / idea of having fun, great, go for it. That’s not a career though and to try and get free work from people who do this as a career is rather pathetic. The people requesting the spec work get paid for their time soliciting it.. yet they don’t feel the need to respect an entire industry and follow a fairly simple protocol?

Isn’t that what your portfolio, and your entire body of work, represents?

If you hire Ray (or any other established illustrator), you’ve got a pretty great idea of what kind of work he does. It’s why he has a portfolio in the first place. You hire based upon that skillset/portfolio/reputation/etc.

I’m sure that Aaron isn’t evil; but the whole “design = contest” thing is killing illustration and design.

Just my 2 cents, you know how much I hate spec work too Ray.

Are you saying that your such a good artist that you are automatically entitled to be paid even if your illustration doesn’t fit that seasons visual style?

Just because you produced a piece of work doesn’t mean it’s good or that it fits the overall plan of a clothing line. Try to think of your illustrations as the surf shots that are submitted from many many photographers on a daily basis. A low rez .jpeg is recieved to help plan where it might fit in the ad campaign. Sometimes it’s what they are lookign for and it’s then purchased. Othertimes it’s not and passed on, even if the shot is amaizing, it may be that they already have 4 shots of Andy ripping a cutty at pipe.

Your art is just one element in an overall design, get over yourself.

Chances are you’d end up with a wrench to the neck.

From the outside – (and that probable fact that you haven’t even recieved a email asking to pull the information), it looks like Billabong has a culture that’s pretty open and laid back (that was the sense I got when I visit them 9 years ago, when Aaron started there.)

Chill with the hate…it doesn’t do anybody any good. If you have problems, fix them.

I read that Dave Gibbons of Watchman fame uses manga studio – he loves it! Read the article, thought of you, heres the link if you are interested:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2009/aug/12/dave-gibbons-watchmen-interview

hope all is well

franks